The China Study

[ptpoul]

Forfatteren mener vist at vi alle allerede har været udsat for kræft, så spørgsmålet er hvor gode udviklingsforhold vi giver kræften?

Forfatteren har da et rimlig solidt reference materialle?

Og igen, samme konklusion er kommer ved at sætte kræftsyge mennesker på whole foods plant based diæter...

Helt konkret: celledeling = risiko for kræft i cellen. Det er i delingen kræften opstår.

Mindsker man frekvensen af celledeling mindsker man risikoen for kræft.

Spiser man meget lidt, sænker man celledelingshastigheden. Spiser man meget lidt protein = mindre celledelingshastighed.

Derfor ser man længere levetid af rotter ved lav kcal diæter, og man mener at se det samme hos mennesker.

Nu er vi på et motionsforum, der er det pænt skidt ikke at kunne danne nyt muskelvæv. For os der vil bygge muskel er højt turnover og høje tilvækstfaktorer et must

[ptpoul]

Enig. Det er bare lidt svært at blive hørt hvis ingen gør sig den umage at læse det man har lavet fordi det ikke får det på forhånd accepterede facit.

Jeg er af samme opfattelse som Incog, hvorfor skulle konsensus være et skidt sted at starte?

Det er et rigtigt skidt sted, hvis man vil sælge en bog, fordi det er ikke pisse sexet. Folk er ikke lykkelige, så de vil have det nye og uprøvede for at finde lykken.

Derfor har jeg grundlæggende en vis allergi over for det nye sensationelle, lad os nu se, er mere min holdning.

[cookie_sq]

Jeg er af samme opfattelse som Incog, hvorfor skulle konsensus være et skidt sted at starte?

Det er et rigtigt skidt sted, hvis man vil sælge en bog, fordi det er ikke pisse sexet. Folk er ikke lykkelige, så de vil have det nye og uprøvede for at finde lykken.

Derfor har jeg grundlæggende en vis allergi over for det nye sensationelle, lad os nu se, er mere min holdning.

Nu forsøger han jo lige netop ikke at være sensationel, han påpeger endda at han ikke er sensationel.

Hans semi religiøs hate på animalsk protein er so and so, men er jo derfor, jeg poster om bogen og forsøger at starte debat.

Og han mangler da helt klart nogle anbefalinger for en trænende atlet, er ikke helt færdig endnu med den.

[pugilist]

Jeg er af samme opfattelse som Incog, hvorfor skulle konsensus være et skidt sted at starte?

Det er et rigtigt skidt sted, hvis man vil sælge en bog, fordi det er ikke pisse sexet. Folk er ikke lykkelige, så de vil have det nye og uprøvede for at finde lykken.

Derfor har jeg grundlæggende en vis allergi over for det nye sensationelle, lad os nu se, er mere min holdning.

Jeg synes egentlig jeg har gjort det så rigeligt klart, at det jeg opponerer mod er når man slutter ved konsensus?

[heliotropen]

Jeg læste bogen da den LIGE kom ud, og kan huske jeg havde en del diskussioner med Cronfeld herinde fra in private.

Jeg husker ikke det hele eksakt i detaljer (hvilket iøvrigt er en klar indikator på at den ikke har været værd at læse, da jeg plejer at huske vigtige ting jeg læser ned i mindste detalje, derimod kan jeg godt glemme mit eget navn osv. men det er jo en hel anden snak)

Det jeg husker fra bogen, var at den var dybt spekulativ, dybt manipulerende, og ikke virkede til at være ordenligt funderet. Meget i samme stil som Mary G. Enigs (PhD) tossede skriblerier om kokusmælk and so on.

Den geniale Jørgen Storm skriver det absolut bedst - jeg tillader mig at poste fra vores ellers personlige korrespondancer:

PENGE spiller naturligvis den altdominerende rolle på det umættelige amerikanske fedme- og livsstilsmarked, og her er første krav til indholdet naturligvis, at det skal postulere en hidtil ukendt og meget gerne modsat teori for at fange massernes interesse.

Og gerne behændigt strikket sammen med en wordwide konspitationsteori!

Det er så helt lige meget om det er nonsens, bare det er anderledes. jvf. Atkinslegen og andre tilsvarende tåbeligheder, substansen er ligegyldig, blot nyhedsværdien og den kedsomhedsfordrivende effekt er høj!

Og man må i hvert fald sige, at pengeliderligheden modsvares af en enorm opfindsomhed med tilhørende total mangel på integritet, hvor der aldrig mangler en læge eller tilsvarende, der vil lægge røv og navn til, da man på en uge på bestsellerlisten kan tjene mere en ti læger på et helt liv.

Generelt er epidemiologiske studier BRUGT på den måde som de er i the china study, til at lukke op og skide i. Google lidt på Dr T. Colin Campbell, så vil du se at de fleste af hans studier er voldsomt kritiserede.

Jeg kan huske at jeg selv har forsøgt at pubmedde meget grundigt, efter hans påstande om at casein skulle være fyldt med carcinogener, det er længere tid siden, men ikke en seriøs henvisning har jeg fundet. Casein (eller noget andet fordøjet protein) er ikke fyldt med carcinogener, derimod har whey faktisk vist sig muligvis at have anti-cancer funktioner.

Her er et par links at starte med:

1: Curr Pharm Des. 2007;13(8):813-28.Click here to read Links

A role for milk proteins and their peptides in cancer prevention.

Parodi PW.

Dairy Australia, Human Nutrition and Health Research, Melbourne, Australia. [email protected]

A role for the amount and type of dietary protein in the etiology of cancer has not been studied extensively. Nevertheless, there is no compelling evidence from epidemiological studies to indicate that protein, at levels usually consumed, is a risk factor for cancer. On the other hand, animal studies suggest that certain peptides and amino acids derived from dietary proteins may influence carcinogenesis. The predominant protein in milk, casein, its peptides, but not liberated amino acids, have antimutagenic properties. Animal models, usually for colon and mammary tumorigenesis, nearly always show that whey protein is superior to other dietary proteins for suppression of tumour development. This benefit is attributed to its high content of cystine/cysteine and gamma-glutamylcyst(e)ine dipeptides, which are efficient substrates for the synthesis of glutathione. Glutathione is an ubiquitous cellular antioxidant that directly or through its associated enzymes destroys reactive oxygen species, detoxifies carcinogens, maintains proteins in a reduced state and ensures a competent immune system. Various experiments showed that tumour prevention by dietary whey protein was accompanied by increased glutathione levels in serum and tissues as well as enhanced splenic lymphocyte proliferation, phagocytosis and natural killer, T helper and cytotoxic T cell activity. Whey protein components, beta-lactoglobulin, alpha-lactalbumin and serum albumin were studied infrequently, but results suggest they have anticancer potential. The minor component lactoferrin has received the most attention; it inhibits intestinal tumours and perhaps tumours at other sites. Lactoferrin acts by induction of apoptosis, inhibition of angiogenesis, modulation of carcinogen metabolising enzymes and perhaps acting as an iron scavenger. Supplementing cows with selenium increases the content of selenoproteins in milk, which on isolation inhibited colon tumorigenesis in rats.

PMID: 17430183 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

1: Nutr Cancer. 2006;55(2):171-7.Click here to read Links

Tumor-protective and tumor-promoting actions of dietary whey proteins in an N-methyl-N-nitrosourea model of rat mammary carcinogenesis.

Eason RR, Till SR, Frank JA, Badger TM, Korourian S, Simmen FA, Simmen RC.

Arkansas Children's Nutrition Center, University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences, AR 72202, USA.

The mammary tumor-protective effects of dietary factors are considered to be mediated by multiple signaling pathways, consistent with the heterogeneous nature of the disease and the distinct genetic profiles of tumors arising from diverse mammary cell populations. In a 7,12-dimethylbenz(a)anthracene-induced model of carcinogenesis, we showed previously that female Sprague-Dawley rats exposed to AIN-93G diet containing whey protein hydrolysate (WPH) beginning at gestation Day 4 had reduced tumor incidence than those exposed to diet containing casein (CAS), due partly to increased mammary differentiation and reduced activity of phase I metabolic enzymes. Here, we evaluated the tumor-protective effects of these same dietary proteins to the direct-acting carcinogen N-methyl-N-nitrosourea (NMU). We found that lifetime exposure to WPH, relative to CAS, decreased mammary tumor incidence and prolonged the appearance of tumors in NMU-treated female rats, with no corresponding effects on tumor multiplicity. At 115 days post-NMU, histologically normal mammary glands from WPH-fed tumor-bearing rats had increased gene expression for the tumor suppressor BRCA1 and the differentiation marker kappa-casein than those of CAS-fed tumor-bearing rats. Tumor-bearing rats from the WPH group had more advanced tumors, with a greater incidence of invasive ductal carcinoma than ductal carcinoma in situ and higher serum C-peptide levels than corresponding rats fed CAS. WPH-fed tumor-bearing rats were also heavier after NMU administration than CAS tumor-bearing rats, although no correlation was noted between body weight and C-peptide levels for either diet group. Results demonstrate the context-dependent tumor-protective and tumor-promoting effects of WPH; provide support for distinct signaling pathways underlying dietary effects on development of mammary carcinoma; and raise provocative questions on the role of diet in altering the prognosis of existing breast tumors.

PMID: 17044772 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

1: J Nutr Biochem. 2006 Sep;17(9):626-34. Epub 2005 Dec 19.Click here to read Links

Dietary whey protein lowers serum C-peptide concentration and duodenal SREBP-1c mRNA abundance, and reduces occurrence of duodenal tumors and colon aberrant crypt foci in azoxymethane-treated male rats.

Xiao R, Carter JA, Linz AL, Ferguson M, Badger TM, Simmen FA.

Arkansas Children's Nutrition Center, University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences, Little Rock, AR 72202, USA.

We evaluated partially hydrolyzed whey protein (WPH) for inhibitory effects on the development of colon aberrant crypt foci (ACF) and intestinal tumors in azoxymethane (AOM)-treated rats. Pregnant Sprague-Dawley rats and their progeny were fed AIN-93G diets containing casein (CAS, control diet) or WPH as the sole protein source. Colons and small intestines from the male progeny were obtained at 6, 12, 20 and 23 weeks after AOM treatment. At 6 and 23 weeks, post-AOM, WPH-fed rats had fewer ACF than did CAS-fed rats. Intestinal tumors were most frequent at 23 weeks, post-AOM. At this time point, differences in colon tumor incidence with diet were not observed; however, WPH-fed rats had fewer tumors in the small intestine (7.6% vs. 26% incidence, P=.004). Partially hydrolized whey protein suppressed circulating C-peptide concentration (a stable indicator of steady-state insulin secretion) at all four time points relative to the corresponding CAS-fed animals. The relative mRNA abundance for the insulin-responsive, transcription factor gene, SREBP-1c, was reduced by WPH in the duodenum but not colon. Results indicate potential physiological linkages of dietary protein type with circulating C-peptide (and by inference insulin), local expression of SREBP-1c gene and propensity for small intestine tumorigenesis.

PMID: 16504496 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

M.V.H

Helio

Edited August 6, 2008 by heliotropen